try again......

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

try again......

Post  ROWLY1971 on Fri Sep 09, 2011 5:29 pm

Although this is not the original post that was deleted, I will try to make the same points.

My main points were the seemingly blinkered fascination of Graham Hyde, I did call him Golden balls in my original post, and the direction the Chairman wants the club to go in.

Firstly Swans 1st appointment I thought done a very credible job tail end of last season. Redhead worked wonders just to scrape a side together every fixture at that stage of a season, for a club already relegated, with no budget, lots of travelling, and no promises about the following season. His teams were full of effort and were never easily beaten, apart from maybe once. They never got the hidings people may of expected them to with the task in hand. I personally think he was used and abused and felt sorry for him not being given a chance in a division lower. Swans opinions soon changed once the season had ended to what they seemed to be when Simon was appointed.
His 2nd appointment also seemed to have his opinion changed quite quickly. After reading what he said about Socket on his appointment, and reading the comments after the sacking, it made me wonder what, if any, serious homework on Socket was ever done.
Already in such a short reign we now have Swans 3rd appointment, and not even a manager this time but a coach. A coach who told Socket on the carpark after the Cirencester defeat that he had no intentions of ever wanting to manage the club, as he was a coach, but who come the Monday was indeed manager of the club! A coach who had been there working with Simon and survived. A coach who had been there with Socket and again survived, but now it seems has no-one to hide behind if things dont improve....unless of course thats what Fenmores there for.

Already since Swans reign Hyde has been made full time because of his 'youth set-up' role and 'community officer' role as well as the Hyde Column in the paper, he now adds 'manager' to his list of saintly tasks! It really is time for the Chairmans Golden Child to stop doing stuff, and do 'Something'

So we now have a Chairman whos opinion seems either easily changed, or not that concrete in the 1st place, with a 'coach' as his 3rd manager.
Is Hyde really going to bring 'youth' 'under 21' and 'local' talent through to the 1st team and share the Chairmans vision, and help pull in 750 through the gate? If not will the Chairman act again, or cant Swan afford to lose a 'manager' 'coach' 'youth set-up man' and 'community officer' with 1 fall of an already bloody axe?

Comments have been made here about reducing the backroom staff as a good thing, but now isnt it the case of having 2 'joint managers' instead of 1 manager 1 assistant and a 'goalkeeping coach' being taken on board where there use to be a '1st team coach'? Seems like same numbers different names to me.

Ask Dave the press guy at the club if I napped the unfolding of all the razzamatazz for its true colours before Socket was even room temperature. I even spoke with Swan on the opening day and he knew my predictions, but I shook his hand and said if he proved me wrong I was man enough to return and thank him. I doubt I will have to though to be honest.

In my honest opinion its all De Ja Vu
The only difference is Redditch has a new circus in town, with a new ring master, new clown and new jugglers.

Please try not to delete my 'opinions' Redjeff when you next do some 'forum cleaning' Rolling Eyes Embarassed

avatar
ROWLY1971
Evo-Stik Prem

Posts : 305
Location : REDDITCH
Join date : 2011-09-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  del boy on Fri Sep 09, 2011 11:37 pm

Just a quick point to make; Mr. Swan didn't appoint Simon Redhead! Martin Sockett was his first appointment.
avatar
del boy
Blue Square North

Posts : 500
Join date : 2011-01-29

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  ROWLY1971 on Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:15 am

Sorry delboy, my mistake, just 2 appointments so far not 3, still 2 sackings though study
avatar
ROWLY1971
Evo-Stik Prem

Posts : 305
Location : REDDITCH
Join date : 2011-09-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  porrohman on Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:20 am

Rowly,
Thanks for coming on again and making your points. It's an unofficial forum and you are entitled to post on here. There's nothing wrong with healthy debate. Often in these circumstances, you'll know things I don't, I'll know things you don't and some middle ground is often found.
Simon Redhead
As Del Boy points out, it was Ken Rae who appointed Simon, and I agree, under very difficult circumstances, he did a sound job. During his tenure I must point out..Graham took the training sessions. Graham had to work with 7/8 players some weeks in training. Graham was the most vocal on the bench. Simon was Manager, but in my opinion Graham ran the show on the pitch. When Chris took over I suspected he'd want a change. A new chairman wanting a change of Manager when he takes the helm isn't a new concept.
Martin Sockett
Never spoke to him so can't comment on what type of bloke he is. I'm sorry but that single performance against Cirencester last week was the most inept display by a Reds team I've seen in years. His lack of communication with Graham on the bench left us all assuming there was some issues there. As for Graham not wanting to be Manager, at 5 to 3 last week 95% of Reds fans wouldn't have wanted to be Manager . At 5 o' clock you would have had a queue to the top of the hill with applicants.
Graham Hyde
I have watched training sessions at the Reds for years. When Graham came, he stood out a mile. When the players weren't getting paid I asked a couple why they stayed and both replied because they were learning so much in training through Graham. Wednesday night saw our Youth team play Telford at The Valley. Graham was there. Encouraging the team. Tuesday's training session saw an Under 21 promoted to train with the first team, and I think he is in the squad today as well. I've heard all this ' he doesn't know non league football' jibes as well. That's rubbish. Under 7's to over 35's, it's all football..it's the same game..and he's played at non league level.
To be honest Rowly I think if Chris had appointed Jose Mourhinho instead of Martin Sockett, he would have got rid of him after Saturday.
You don't become as succesful a businessman as Chris has by pussy footing around.
To conclude, from my point of view as a fan..I'm delighted Hydey is in charge with Fenners. Since Graham came to the club the training has improved beyond recognition ( apart from when he was GK training).
avatar
porrohman
Blue Square Prem
Blue Square Prem

Posts : 1012
Join date : 2011-01-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  rawlings09 on Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:09 am

I saw Sockett in charge for 17 games. We struggled against Mickey Mouse teams in pre-season friendlies and even in those games he wasn't communicating with Hydey and Paul Smith Leant against the dug-out.

I've missed 1 or 2 away games but seen all the home games and the story has been the same. The 2 bumchums huddled with their note pads and the premier league experienced Hydey being ignored.

There was only so much that could go on for.

I can take losses if we play well and lose... that was the story of last season. But playing like we did against Cirencester was the worst i've seen since 4 years of coming down.

And i couldn't see sockett turning it around.

Hydey has the experience, Fenners has the contacts... that's a winning team for me Very Happy
avatar
rawlings09
Blue Square Prem
Blue Square Prem

Posts : 1139
Location : Nowhere near Blyth
Join date : 2011-01-04

View user profile http://redshoponline.goshopper.net/

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  Leethall on Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:23 am

I know everybody is getting emotional and views are great.

Sockett was a mistake and it was proven in that he was out of his depth.

Fenners and Hydey, well the proof is in the pudding so that starts today, football is a results business so for all the great training, contacts etc winning games is the key. Ok performances are also important but until they deliver on the field it is hope!
avatar
Leethall
Football League
Football League

Posts : 1845
Location : Village Branch
Join date : 2011-01-04

View user profile http://www.rufc-trust.co.uk/trust/

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  JBS on Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:51 am

For what its worths I agree with 90% of what Rowly1971 says, I still dont agree with Redhead getting the boot we certainly wouldn't be in a worse position now if we kept the satus-quo. As I said before, I enjoyed watching the games the end of last season and if 90% of that was down to Hyde whats changed between now and May that means he wasnt appointed then but is now?

However I am happy that Hyde has the job now going forward.

We may know the reasons why we have had three managment changes in such a short time, but to an outsider it looks just as farcial as it always has.

JBS
Evo-Stik Division one

Posts : 124
Join date : 2011-01-06

View user profile http://twitter.com/redditch_united

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  porrohman on Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:59 am

Well done JBS.That's why this forum has to be un official. Fans posting their OWN thoughts.
avatar
porrohman
Blue Square Prem
Blue Square Prem

Posts : 1012
Join date : 2011-01-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  ROWLY1971 on Sat Sep 10, 2011 3:04 am

Some great points, opinions and bounce offs!

My main points and queries were not that Socket should of kept his job, but how much of a manager had he changed being since being appointed? Managers dont change managing styles to suit clubs, they manage how they know how to manage. Formations, football style, technical area behaviour. I cant believe enough case study was put in to get the right manager in place at the start of this huge season for the club and promote stability, which every club looking to improve and move forward needs. Is there really a good enough game plan in place as we are led to believe? Chris Swan may be a superb and wealthy business man as someone pointed out, but this is not business its football. Bigger and better business people than Swan have proved time and time before that the same rules cannot or do not apply.

Hydes ability to manage is of course unknown as yet. He may or may not be a good coach, depending on who you listen to or what you see, but to be coach AND manager AND youth set up AND community officer...wow.

The facts are:
at the beginning of September the club are already trying to learn from own made mistakes since the new owners took over study

stability has NOT been achieved and direction looks cloudier than we may of 1st thought. FAIL

the club is being managed by a 1st time manager Whistling

players are leaving for 1 reason or another, good or bad, so a settled side looks miles off Baseball Bat

redditch fans still want the best for their club cheers

Good luck to the team today, and the travelling fans i hope you have something to cheer about and 3points to come home with
avatar
ROWLY1971
Evo-Stik Prem

Posts : 305
Location : REDDITCH
Join date : 2011-09-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  porrohman on Sat Sep 10, 2011 3:10 am

I commend Rowly for his use of the emoticons. Beer Cheers
avatar
porrohman
Blue Square Prem
Blue Square Prem

Posts : 1012
Join date : 2011-01-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  del boy on Sat Sep 10, 2011 3:37 am

ROWLY1971 wrote: Chris Swan may be a superb and wealthy business man as someone pointed out, but this is not business its football. Bigger and better business people than Swan have proved time and time before that the same rules cannot or do not apply.


Have you not noticed how many non-league football clubs have gone to the wall in the last few years? Football clubs have been dropping like flies. More often than not, it's because those in charge seem to think that the normal rules of business do not apply to them! Yes they do!

As a business, football is unique. But a business it is, and should be run as such.

I don't know if Mr. Swan has ever run a football club before? If not, then he is at the start of a learning curve with regards to making football based decisions. Maybe he is not the 'perfect chairman', but his takeover of the club and recent investment has been the best thing to ever happen to our club, at least in my lifetime. Only a fool could suggest otherwise.

As for Graham Hyde, being a first time manager is not an issue for me. Everybody has to start somewhere. An experienced player, then gaining coaching experience before moving into management is a natural progression. Personally, I do wonder why he wasn't given the job in the summer? Listening to him from the terrace, it's quite evident that he is passionate about what he does and knows what he's talking about.

No matter which way our results and performance go from here, Graham Hyde has to be given a decent run at being manager. I don't think it would be wise of Mr. Swan to part company with another manager anytime soon.
avatar
del boy
Blue Square North

Posts : 500
Join date : 2011-01-29

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  rawlings09 on Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:11 am

And if it all fails... we blame fenners What a Face
avatar
rawlings09
Blue Square Prem
Blue Square Prem

Posts : 1139
Location : Nowhere near Blyth
Join date : 2011-01-04

View user profile http://redshoponline.goshopper.net/

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  Leethall on Sat Sep 10, 2011 6:47 am

rawlings09 wrote:And if it all fails... we blame fenners What a Face

Standard, it is the Rules
avatar
Leethall
Football League
Football League

Posts : 1845
Location : Village Branch
Join date : 2011-01-04

View user profile http://www.rufc-trust.co.uk/trust/

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  SID SNOT on Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:57 pm

rawlings09 wrote:

Hydey has the experience, Fenners has the contacts... that's a winning team for me Very Happy

Hyde has never managed?! And I'm sure Fennemore has thousands of contacts from his failed spell at Racing Club Warwick and as reserve team manager of Rugby in 2007?!

I've enjoyed reading Rowly's posts, and agree with a lot of what he has said. Hyde doesn't seem to be able to do anything wrong, and he is seen as some kind of footballing genious because he runs a few decent coaching sessions. Any qualified coach could come down and do this on a Thursday night, it doesn't mean he should manage the club. As for Mark Fennemore, I am still waiting for someone to tell me what the f*** he is all about?!

I can't see a huge amount changing under the new regime. It was quite evident things weren't working under Sockett, but felt a bit sorry for him as he was obviously lumbered with Hyde and Fennemore, which I'm sure effected his ability to do his job. How many other teams in the Southern League, have a manager, assistant, coach and director of football all sat on the bench, it was farcical.

I feel that Mr Swann should have taken this opportunity to clear everyone out, learn from his mistakes and start again. I know he isn't everyone's cup of tea, but I would have loved to have seen Carl Heggs given a chance. Someone who knows the club, was part of any recent 'success' that we have had, did a decent job at Kings Lynn until the plug was pulled and actually does have excellent contacts in the game. Yes he would probably want a wage, but I can't think it would be anywhere near as much as what Sockett, Smith, Hyde and Fennemore were jointly being paid.
avatar
SID SNOT
Evo-Stik Division one

Posts : 65
Join date : 2011-01-16

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  ROWLY1971 on Sat Sep 10, 2011 2:38 pm

del boy wrote: but his takeover of the club and recent investment has been the best thing to ever happen to our club, at least in my lifetime. Only a fool could suggest otherwise.

And if the going gets too tough, or the critics too much, or just simply bored...then what?

Personally I think the safest non league team are the 1s that are owned by the fans, and not 1 person who could be said to be on an ego trip or dipping into a bit of out of hours business fun, capable of walking away at any time and not losing his well earnt business reputation.

Opinion not fact or cheap knock.
avatar
ROWLY1971
Evo-Stik Prem

Posts : 305
Location : REDDITCH
Join date : 2011-09-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  ROWLY1971 on Sat Sep 10, 2011 2:45 pm

SID SNOT wrote: I've enjoyed reading Rowly's posts, and agree with a lot of what he has said. Hyde doesn't seem to be able to do anything wrong, and he is seen as some kind of footballing genious because he runs a few decent coaching sessions. Any qualified coach could come down and do this on a Thursday night, it doesn't mean he should manage the club. As for Mark Fennemore, I am still waiting for someone to tell me what the f*** he is all about?!

Thanks Sid.
I do believe it unhealthy for any club to be entrusted so much in the hands of 1 man as much as RUFC seems to be with Swans allowance of Hyde to do so.
I would like to make it clear I have never spoken or conversed with Hyde, and this is NOT a personal vendetta in any shape, just a concern.

Was it true that in todays game Hydes RUFC team did not have a shot on target until the 89th minute?
avatar
ROWLY1971
Evo-Stik Prem

Posts : 305
Location : REDDITCH
Join date : 2011-09-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  Bob Marley on Sat Sep 10, 2011 2:52 pm

1st of all....I once again thank Mr Swan for saving the Reds.
If he had not put 100k into the club in mid-March, this forum, club, team, history, ground etc. etc. would not exist anymore...and that's a fact.

In February of last year, I personally paid a Sheriff's Officer 1k to prevent him taking the goalposts, 1st team kit, all the balls, all the office equipment etc etc the day before a home game....so I know how close the end was.

Mr Swan has earned the right to make good decisions, bad decisions or any kind of decision he likes....he is walking the walk and anyone who is involved with the club can see how much it means to him and Sallie...much more than anyone anticipated.

I remember in early April at the TRUST AGM, Mr Swan described his strategy for the club;

1. To be debt free
2. Raise corporate sponsorship and funtion income
3. For the club to operate within its financial means with tight budget control
4. Implement procedures and operating standards to prevent the mis-management of the past
5. To develop local talent into the 1st team
6. To develop young players through a enhanced youth system and under 21's
7. To build strong community links within the Redditch community

I think anyone can see he is delivering on these commitments and like any good business manager, if his employees do not share the strategy of the organisation, then bring people in who do....that's life...it's tough.

I think it's highly unfair to criticise Mr Swan for not wanting to pay this or that player what he wants....that is EXACTLY the attitude that nearly killed this club...so think on!

I saw the success that Mr Sinton has bought to AFC Telford.....I remember reading that he was a great coach and never a manager.....I hope Mr Hyde brings half the success they have seen in Shropshire under Sinton's tenure.

Onwards & upwards.


avatar
Bob Marley
Blue Square Prem
Blue Square Prem

Posts : 1075
Location : Virginia Beach
Join date : 2011-01-08

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  JBS on Sat Sep 10, 2011 3:11 pm

ROWLY1971 wrote:
Was it true that in todays game Hydes RUFC team did not have a shot on target until the 89th minute?

According to someone on the St Albans forum, we had one shot on target and another reckons 2-0 was flattering on us.

Cant really judge on one game 6 days after taking over though to be fair.

JBS
Evo-Stik Division one

Posts : 124
Join date : 2011-01-06

View user profile http://twitter.com/redditch_united

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  del boy on Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:53 pm

ROWLY1971 wrote:
del boy wrote: but his takeover of the club and recent investment has been the best thing to ever happen to our club, at least in my lifetime. Only a fool could suggest otherwise.

And if the going gets too tough, or the critics too much, or just simply bored...then what?

Personally I think the safest non league team are the 1s that are owned by the fans, and not 1 person who could be said to be on an ego trip or dipping into a bit of out of hours business fun, capable of walking away at any time and not losing his well earnt business reputation.

Opinion not fact or cheap knock.

Football clubs are left knee deep in it when a wealthy benefactor (who bankrolls a team beyond its means) gets bored and then pulls out. Mr. Swan is trying to build a team that is self sustainable. The truth is that Mr. Swan could get bored and pull out tomorrow; but if he did so, he would leave the club in the healthiest state it has ever been in.

Fan owned clubs are a nice idea in theory. The reality is that Redditch United simply do not have enough fans for this to be an option for our club.

I don't know our Chairman and have never spoken to him personally. I have no bias towards him or anyone else. But to be a successful business man, you don't give up at the first sign of difficulty! It's not as if he bought the club on a whim either. He spent a long time weighing up the options before committing. Before taking over, he would have been well aware of an attendance of 76 for a midweek home game, when the club was at it's all time lowest point.

You do seem to have an axe to grind. For what reason, only you know.
avatar
del boy
Blue Square North

Posts : 500
Join date : 2011-01-29

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  ROWLY1971 on Sun Sep 11, 2011 12:14 am

del boy wrote:You do seem to have an axe to grind. For what reason, only you know.

I assure you Del, no axe to grind here.
Just because I may be sceptical does not mean I have a personal axe that needs a sharpen.
I have spoke with Swan and told him my reservations and why, and told him if Im proven wrong I will gladly go to him shake his hand and say well done, and thank you. Well done for the huge task, and thank him because Im Redditch born n bred and would love nothing more for the club, and its fans, to be successful.

I know there may be words for me, or the type of person that doesnt jump onto a new band wagon that rolls into town, and Im aware some of the words may not be pleasant ones, but Im sorry thats me.

Please dont think Im only here to knock, or play Devils Advocate, Im not. Opinions make a football roll.
avatar
ROWLY1971
Evo-Stik Prem

Posts : 305
Location : REDDITCH
Join date : 2011-09-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  porrohman on Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:10 am

Sid Snot,
May I respectfully suggest if you want to know what the 'f*$& Mark Fenemore is all about' as you so eloquently put it, you actually call him on his mobile and ask him. It's not up to anyone on here to tell you his footballing CV.
A word of warning, if he starts to talk about growing grass on a pitch, make an excuse and get off the phone sharpish! Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep
avatar
porrohman
Blue Square Prem
Blue Square Prem

Posts : 1012
Join date : 2011-01-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  in2thevalley on Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:08 am





Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep
avatar
in2thevalley
Football League
Football League

Posts : 1640
Location : Here
Join date : 2011-01-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  SID SNOT on Mon Sep 12, 2011 2:08 am

porrohman wrote:Sid Snot,
May I respectfully suggest if you want to know what the 'f*$& Mark Fenemore is all about' as you so eloquently put it, you actually call him on his mobile and ask him. It's not up to anyone on here to tell you his footballing CV.
A word of warning, if he starts to talk about growing grass on a pitch, make an excuse and get off the phone sharpish! Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep

Porrohman
I am simply asking for some clarity on how on earth somoeone with such a poor record within management at a significantly lower level to what we are playing has been given the responsibility to manage our club? Albeit in a joint capacity.

I'm sure we were all hoping with the investment that we have had this season to have at least a push at the payoffs. Would you entrust this job in someone with a CV that contains numerous number 2/assitant/reserve team roles within teams in lower leagues, and a number one role where RCW were relegated to the Midland Alliance? No of course you wouldn't. Would you entrust someone with Socketts profile and track record in local non league football, possibly for a bit longer than he was given, or an ex Premiership footballer with coaching qualifications coming out of his ears, again possibly in his own right.

Mr Swan has done so much for our club but I am confused my some of the footballing decisions that have been made since his arrival with regards to management. Redhead can consider himself unfortunate, Sockett even more so, as a seven game reign at a new club with a totally new squad was never enough time IMO.

Although he has no management experience Hyde should have the knowledge, coaching experience, contacts and profile in the game to take us in the right direction. Mr Fenermore I'm not too sure has.
avatar
SID SNOT
Evo-Stik Division one

Posts : 65
Join date : 2011-01-16

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  ted striker on Mon Sep 12, 2011 3:49 am

SID SNOT wrote:I'm sure we were all hoping with the investment that we have had this season to have at least a push at the payoffs. Would you entrust this job in someone with a CV that contains numerous number 2/assitant/reserve team roles within teams in lower leagues, and a number one role where RCW were relegated to the Midland Alliance? No of course you wouldn't.

To be fair to Mark Fenemore, I don't think that anyone could have prevented RCW's slide down the leagues. A team with fewer supporters than Redditch, playing on a pitch that was generally far worse than the worst Valley surfaces over the last few years, and in my experience with the local radio a few seasons ago, the most obnoxious backroom staff you could ever wish to avoid. They were always just avoiding relegation from the Dr Martens Midland/Western Division, and when it finally happened they had a run comparable to ours last season - well in excess of 30 matches without a victory. That's not solely down to a poor first-team manager, it's also a sign of a poorly-run club behind the scenes. Clearly things haven't improved over the years since, and as this article points out, they will have been hit hard by the revival of Leamington FC.

ted striker
Evo-Stik Prem

Posts : 306
Join date : 2011-01-19

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  rawlings09 on Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:44 am

Sockett must have realised the ambition of the Chairman... and when the Chairman saw he wasn't the right man he axed him.

I must say if i was the Chairman, and i wanted to get into playoffs or promoted, and i saw a Manager and an assistant manager ignoring the coach, not saying anything from the bench, not saying anything to the fans, clearly having no connection with players then i'd question his ability, albeit after 7 games.

Im glad it's done early though, we've still got the rest of the season to recover.
avatar
rawlings09
Blue Square Prem
Blue Square Prem

Posts : 1139
Location : Nowhere near Blyth
Join date : 2011-01-04

View user profile http://redshoponline.goshopper.net/

Back to top Go down

Re: try again......

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum